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hey guys,
what is the correct money strategy when multitabling a bunch of cash games. I have learned to stick by the 5% max rule at a table, (ala chris ferguson's experiment). does this mean that I can put 5% on every table? that just doesnt sound right.
I would not risk more then 10% of my bankroll at any given day, and I think 5% is even better - across all tables, not just one
If you are multitabling and playing at the same good level as if you were single tabling, you can put 5% on each or as much as you would normally on one table.
It's the same as playing multible tables one after another so no reason to limit yourself just because of multitabling.
In theory you are right ofcourse, since the variance factor is spread over multiple tables.Quote:
Originally Posted by topsoyale
However most of us have days when we do not play our 'A' game, and it usually takes a while to realize it, if you play 6 tables, with 5% of your bankroll in each and you have a bad day you can easily lose 20% of your bankroll.
I would not risk over 10% of my bankroll in any given day
This is true.
I think once you get to greater than 3 tables and realise sensibly that your play is going to suffer or that a cold streak would leave you feeling down having lost >10% of your roll, it's time to move down limits.
heres the thing...to me. and its just my opinion from my background in sales.
its a numbers game...in terms of hands dealt.
so long as your bankroll is adequate (20-30 buy-ins for your level), what difference does it make how many tables you open? or how much you risk in a day? or whatever?
dont get me wrong, i understand the "rules" and why they are in place...and so should anyone trying to multi-table (meaning they are taking the game more seriously than most).
but, imo, its all about the hands you are dealt. AA WILL get cracked. J3o in the blinds WILL suckout sometimes. those will both benefit you and piss you off when they work against you.
however, if your winrate is positive...none of this matters...so long as you are following proper bankroll management. meaning, you dont play over your head. and hopefully, tilt doesnt affect you too badly, either.
in sales...it was all about the numbers of calls you made...the rest was crap. you had good days, great days, and days that made you want to jump off a bridge on the way home. but as long as you kept making calls, those bad days turned around to good days again.
poker is the same. if you see 100k hands, you will have ups and downs...but if your winrate is positive...you WILL make money over the 100k hands.
period. so, like in sales...how long do you want it to take to make money? a week? a year? multi-tabling allows you to significantly cut down the time. if you dare, take advantage of it. most winning online players do.
if you decide to multi-table...open some up, and play with your head. find out how many is too many...for YOU, and stick to that. how much money you risk in a session or day, 5% or 10%, is all crap. you should win money at YOUR win rate.
just make sure its positive before you try...and keep those hands coming...at the end you will show positive results.
but, who am i to say "jesus" is full of crap...lol.
I think that makes sence in a vacume. That if your winrate is x/100 then weather you play 500 or 5k hands a day profit will be the same ratio. You risk 5% at one table is like saying i can risk 5%BR per 80 hands/hour. so 10%br @ 160hands/hour would yeild same fluctuations.
BUT
Were not in a vacume and if we go on tilt (wich WILL happen) on one table now the other 80hands/hour we are playing badly as oppesed to starting the next day playing 80hands/hour well.
There has to be a happy meduim of how well we play/ (%ev)number hands per hour - tilt factor (-EV)
Lets say we can play out A game fresh at 3.0BB/100 hands
we'll say 6 max FL for an easy round number with 100 h/ph.
After a bad beat we might play a b game worth 2.0bb/100 hands.
If we get slaughtered we drop to tiltafied game @ -10BB/100 hands
If we play 1 table a day for 3 hours we might play 1 hour A game and 2 b game on an average day. for a total of 7BB
if we tilt out we play 1 hour of A then B then F for a total of
-5bb
Now 5bb wont hurt our roll but if we played 10 tables that 50BB, now yes we also win more but that only covers %ev.
The more tables we spread out the higher the varience gets. the more of a cash loss you take even though you ev loss will be relitvly the same. I think when you multi table you must have a larger then normal bankroll for this reason.
Even though the varience IS spread your just spreading out %EV,
mutitabling you may go +100, -300, +50, -300, +250, +250=50bb
where as one table you go +20, -60, +10, -60, +50, +50=10BB
At one point your down 450B MTing wheras your only down 90 bb n one table. Eventhough %won X amount invested is the same you take much larger swings Multi tabling.
hope this helps
i think the 20 buy in rule (which i stick to) is very adequate for playing 4 tables - That is said in a vaccuum of course and assuming you can handle 4 tables....
the 5% and 10% thing i've never adhered to....i guess if you play 4 tables at 50NL and you have a $1k BR, you are playing with 20% of your roll....which is too high according to that stat - but if you are capable of handling 4 tables well, the 20 buy in rule should be fine - if you are playing scared or can't handle playing that many, don't do it - only you can know this -
it depends on how serious you are I suppose - To me, the BR isn't my Life roll - if your BR is your Life Roll then you damn well better protect it...and in that case risking 20% at a time is too much, obviously....to me though, if i lose a bunch of money i just take a week or 2 off and redeposit....so i guess that should factor into your decision also -
$200 10nl
$500 25nl
$1000 50nl
$2000 100nl
$5000 200nl
$15000 400nl
$25000 600nl
$50000 1000nl
For me the main criteria is playing within your comfort limits. I play 4 x $25 tables at a time with a BR of $1600. I moved up from $10 tables at with a $700 roll about 3 months ago, initially playing 2 $25 and 2 $10 tables. I am now contemplating trying 1 0r 2 $50 tables in the 4 I play, but still don't feel comfortable enough yet, the thought of dropping $100+ in a session is not something I feel ready to face yet!. Some may say this is too conservative, but for me, if I'm playing even slightly scared, I won't play correctly.
With regard to whether 5% 0n each table is correct, I think if you are happy with your game and disciplined enough to avoid tilting when things arent going your way, then its fine. In my experience, its rare to be dropping $ across all 4 tables and when I do have a bad session, I try to limit the loss to no more than 2 buy ins. Once I hit that benchmark, I know I will be getting a little testy and prone to making questionable decisions, so I switch off the computer and go and do something else. I may not be making money as fast as I potentially could I know, but I'm also limiting my losses and heading off the circumstances where I will be prone to tilting.
Just my 2c.
Perfect advice. I believe in not risking more than 5% of my bankroll on one HAND. Not one session or one day. That's what's important.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chopper
If you lose 5% and buy back in, it's EXACTLY the same as losing 5% and playing again tomorrow.
If you don't risk more for emotional reasons or something, that's fine and great, but don't put those problems on other people. Most people can lose a hand and continue to play well.
This could involve moving up and down in limits during one session, depending on how much leeway you give yourself on your percentage and how soon you move up. That's fine too, just stick to whatever rules you make.
To sum up: I believe in making the stakes I play a direct function of my bankroll. And because I have the discipline to move down if I need to DURING a session, I can play multiple tables at that limit without increasing the needed size. I just watch my total bankroll carefully to determine where I should be.
Does it matter whether it's FR or 6-Max? I'm currently 4-tabling NL10 6-Max at PS and my bankroll is reaching $500. I was thinking of waiting until $750 before moving up until I read Renton's post.Quote:
Originally Posted by Renton