Quote Originally Posted by iopq
well say you calculate that the set mining/flopping oesd draws is break even if you call a raise
as in you will only cover the amount of the raise by set mining

then your ability to take it away post flop is the exact amount you will gain
if your attempts of taking it away post-flop are EV- then you shouldn't attempt it and deuces will be EV neutral
if your attempts are EV+ you should do it and deuces will be EV+

but with 79o if you call a raise you're already the amount of the raise behind since you're going to flop a straight or an oesd a very small percentage of the time
so you have to be VERY good at taking it away post flop since you're already 4-5BB behind every time you stick around in a raised pot with 79o

so 79o is going to be almost always EV- to limp/call unless you have a huge post-flop edge
but 22 might be a good hand to limp and call a raise even if your edge is very small

but both hands will perform better in late position if you raise them and have a chance of taking the blinds
I don't dispute your specifics at all (except I would note that you're about 1 in 12 to get an OESD with 97, and you also will sometimes flop top pair, two pair, or trips, so while 22 is clearly a superior hand it isn't a hugely superior one). Indeed, I probably play 22 five or six times as often as 97, so obviously in my own game I consider it a better hand!

I was just making the more general point that when you don't hit your set with 22 (i.e., 7 of 8 times), you are basically relying on your ability to outplay your opponents post-flop to win the hand, which is exactly what you might do with a variety of different hands if you decided to play them. If you can do it, fine-- I don't in any way criticize players for playing hands that they can get positive EV out of. But it's probably entirely possible to become a profitable poker player without playing low pocket pairs other than in favorable setmining situations. If a player finds these hands difficult to play postflop, there's nothing at all wrong with just not playing them.