Implied Odds question

This might be elementary but since I have never read a poker book it's something I've been wondering for a while now.

If we're in a spot where we are thinking about calling a raise where we would be getting 10:1 implied odds in a HU pot would it be 20:1 if the same pot was 3-way?

Did that make sense?

I understand what you're asking and the answer is probably not. The answer would be yes if you think both villains are likely to put 10 bets in after you hit.

To calculate the true implied odds you would look at how much you expect each villain to put into the pot after you make your hand. So one villain may be willing to stack off for 10 bets while the other might call 3 and see the action and decide to fold, so your odds would be 13:1.

That sounds right.

That's kind of what I was hoping to hear...I'm really looking for ways to extend my range in multiway 3bet pots.

So for example we have effective stacks of 100bb and flat 77 on the button against UTG's 3x open and SB squeezes to 10x then UTG calls the 3bet we can correctly call?

well maybe depending on villains' ranges and relative postflop skills but in general smallish pairs do not play well in a 3b pot.

Implied odds more than anything else is a judgement call. Against some opponents you can never call a pocket pair preflop for 3bb while 100bb deep because they just do not ever stack off with anything that is beaten by a set. But when they play that way you can call with any trash and just steal with impunity after the flop because they fold too often.

Implied odds is only tangentially about numbers. It's more than anything about accurately determining how much your opponent will pay you when the card that makes your hand (and presumably is scary!) comes on the board. People playing narrow and strong ranges (not unusual in 3bet situations) generally stack off lighter. People playing wide and weak ranges generally only stack off with genuinely big hands.

One way of considering which types of hands to play in different situations is to consider that if action becomes frenzied and you end up seeing a showdown in a big pot what kind of hand would you like to have? TPTK - play high cards. Sets? Play pocket pairs. Flushes? Play suited cards. Etc etc etc. When you are considering a multiway hand you may want to emphasize big hand potential in your hand selection.

In mutiway pots you should probably consider pot controlling more easily with TPGK or second pair type hands - hands that might be best, but if they're not best will cost you a lot of money - and then play your TPTK and any draws harder. It doesn't matter if all you have on the flop is an overcard, a backdoor flush and a backdoor straight draw - you still have nut making potential. If ppl fold anyway it doesn't matter. If they call and you get a card towards your backdoor flush/straight you have another profitable semi-bluffing opportunity on the turn. If you end up hitting your flush or straight on the river you probably have very good implied odds because people don't give you credit for playing what is perceived as a long shot.

Originally Posted by nish81

if you're set farming, I think the effective stacks have to be 15x the raise that you're thinking about calling. so you're thinking about calling 7xbb and villain has 90xbb left in his stack, 7*15 is 105..but you have two villains in the game. depending how much you think you could get from each one, maybe you could justify calling here.

i'm a noob btw, dont mind my wrong advice

Welcome to FTR, and please keep posting.

It's true in general that you need AT LEAST 15x to set mine at levels like 50nl+, but I prefer 20x set odds for flatting.

Like para says, 3b/squeezed pots are a different dynamic. The squeeze is generally weak and not as likely to stack off, and if the PFR is flatting the squeeze he probably is unwilling to stack off, too.

In a straight up 3b pot, we're more likely to stack villains when we hit a set, but we still need nearly 15x+ set odds (imo).

At lower limits (say 10nl) set hunting is profitable in a lot more situations, obv.

Glad to see a lot of discussion on the matter but that was just an example...I'm really just asking if you calculate them based on villains combined stacks or effective stacks. I think Para answered my question though.