I really truly need some motivation here

I am just so impatient with poker, when I play, I want to win, and win now, and the thing is, I know it doesn't work like that. I push with hands that are really marginal cause i "know" they are bluffing and I go to far with to many hands. The sad thing is I know I'm doing all these things and I know I am wrong in doing so, just cause I feel I need to bluff or think the other player is bluffing.

How did you guys become so patient, and is this a problem with new players. I see all you guys with massive bankrolls, and I'm thinking i need to be up there and soon. Instead, I have lost quite a bit, reload, lose more, get impatient, reload, lose that quicker.

Is there some words of wisdom to help me with this problem, or share any experience with those that when they begun playing poker had similar issues. I'm on the verge of just calling it quits, and I don't want to do that cause I have invested so much time and money into just learning the game.

Also, could you give me some insight as to how long it actually took to build your bankroll?

Thanks guys

I am not nearly among the top players here, so take that for what it's worth....

I started playing seriously with $250 in December of 2005. I cleared a ton of bonuses, had a ton of rakeback, several withdrawals, and several mind-numbing, confidence crushing downswings combined with bad play. After 15 months more or less, my BR is $7400 as of today.

I was breakeven at several levels for a LONG time before I actually started beating them.

I'm not gonna lie, I'm not even close to break even

Its a marathon, not a sprint.

If you think you need to rush it its probably best to just quit now because you cant win with that mentality.

We have some stupidly good players on this site and all of them had to do a lot of work to get there. You arent one of those players and quite probably never will be. You also dont have to be to make a reasonable amount of money. Slow down and let it happen when it does. You cant rush anything at this game especially at the low stakes when you should basically be nut camping.

You probably know all of this already so its a discipline thing. Slap your self every time you decide something is stupid and do it anyway.

I think I can pin point two of my problems:

1. I see some of you guys just tear up the place, have no problem rolling over nubs such as myself and I think to myself it can't be that hard no can it?

2. I see nubs such as myself making bank by truly being lucky, in fact, just earlier today I got whooped up on by a 620, and I had the ever so weak hand KK. And I see this so often that I feel I should be playing these hands more often, which I know is wrong, but I see it making so much money

Poker is hard....don't kid yourself. It takes MENTAL discipline. I don't always have that, and it usually costs me.

Also, don't kid yourself. If you find yourself playing 62 offsuit on a regular basis, you will go broke, FAST!!

I've just had such a horrible poker weekend this...weekend, getting whooped up on by A7 when I have AK, hitting my straight, the river card the guy hits his boat, general things like that, and hands like AQ, AJ, KJ, even if they are way stronger than the hands I go up against, I am just getting wasted.

Maybe what I need i just a break, I play a bunch, lose a bunch, and it gets frustrating

How long did it take for you guys to actually learn the game of poker. I have read a few books, and the articles on this site and 2+2, and so far no dice maybe i'm not applying it properly

Originally Posted by housefish17

How did you guys become so patient, and is this a problem with new players? I see all you guys with massive bankrolls...

you mentioned "bonus-chasing. yes, that did it for me. that and reading some/most of the beginning stickies here. while chasing bonuses, i/you cannot stand to lose any of what i/you brought to the table because it "cuts into the free money." that should provide the patience you speak of.

Originally Posted by housefish17

Is there some words of wisdom to help me with this problem?

yes. 1) stick to a starting hand chart for awhile. how long? you'll know. but, maybe aokrongly's starting 19. or read some other posts about starting hands. 2) if you can COMMITT to that, open another table or two. right now, you need to be playing the cards, not the player. lower stakes are perfect for that, and by opening a couple tables, you will be searching ONLY for those cards. and, thereby, playing ONLY those cards.

if you open enough tables to hold your concentration (and i am not recommending opening more than 3), you will not be so apt to play the crappy cards because you will know it's only another few minutes until you see something (AJ, KQ, 44) that you can play.

Originally Posted by housefish17

Also, could you give me some insight as to how long it actually took to build your bankroll?

building a bankroll is different for everybody, and i would like to see some stories here, too. not only modest ones, but some heroic...honest ones.

for me, i started in november '05 (edit: must have been '04. WOW...the time!) with a "borrowed" $25 from my brother. played the $5 NL and $10 NL because i didnt want to lose it with AA against some trash due to luck. i slowly built it to around $200 with the goal of getting it big enough to "chase bonuses." i took some shots, nervous ones at that, at $25, and found it much the same. only i had some money to grab a bonus or two. that sped things up a great deal. bought pokertracker, and cleared some more bonuses. moved up to 50NL at around $450ish, but permanently at $600. got to 100NL soon after, and havent gone any higher. i dont like bluffing with $75, no matter the size of my br. just cant get past the "fear of losing." so, i started taking a couple hundred a month out to have fun with, and REALLY liked the free money...as did the wife. br never grew much after that. just kept chasing and cashing. long story short...had a br (including withdrawals) of over $3k in about 18 mos. all off of a "borrowed" $25, and GOOD BR MGMT and PATIENCE.

sadly, that aint too fast. its good, and i'm proud of it, but it's peanuts compared to some other more aggressive guys that wanted to move up in limits, and go all the way.

hope this helped.

still learning. Always will be.

Remember this too...even AK will only win less than 80% of the time.

Starting hands are only that....starting hands. They aren't a license to the pot.

Everyone has bad weekends. The bad thing about poker is that it seems like all the good fortune comes at once, and so does all the bad fortune.....

Get poker tracker. Play 100,000 hands. Then move up to $25NL, play 100,000 hands move up to $50NL. Then play 200,00 hands hit the worst downswing of your life and move back down to $25NL. Hate poker for a few weeks, comeback and play 100,000 hands and move up to $50NL again. This is the rules, do not try to circumvent them. Every one has to do this, then and only then will you start to make a decent rate of return for your time.

Good Luck

Originally Posted by housefish17

Also, could you give me some insight as to how long it actually took to build your bankroll?

I started on Party and it took me about 2 weeks to become a winning player (although the first couple weeks of winning were probably pretty freakin' lucky), and then from there it took about 3 weeks to move up to 50NL ($1000). Of course, I was playing every second I could, like 6-8 hours per day plus working full-time. Weekends? Pft.

Several times I've blown most of my bankroll buying things (or taking like four months off of work one time), and the time to build back varied.

My last rebuild was from about $40 and it took me about 5 months to reach $2500, although I was only playing probably an average of one or two hours per day and had a couple of disgustingly bad runs. Also, let it be known I play four or more tables at a time.

Originally Posted by Trainer_jyms

Get poker tracker. Play 100,000 hands. Then move up to $25NL, play 100,000 hands move up to $50NL. Then play 200,00 hands hit the worst downswing of your life and move back down to $25NL. Hate poker for a few weeks, comeback and play 100,000 hands and move up to $50NL again. This is the rules, do not try to circumvent them. Every one has to do this, then and only then will you start to make a decent rate of return for your time.

Good Luck

lol i doubt many people need that many hands to get to 50NL

Originally Posted by Chopper

played the $5 NL and $10 NL all off of a "borrowed" $25,

Originally Posted by Chopper

...and GOOD BR MGMT

lol doesnt sound like it ;p

I started with $5.50 SNGs; it took me about 20 of them to break even (small sample size I know) and after 50 I had a ROI of about 25%. After three months of playing maybe 2 or 3 an evening, I moved to $25NL full ring cash, quickly made $150, quickly lost $143, then moved to £25 (simply because a friend said it was "easier") and have never looked back.

Made about $6k playing £25NL (which is financially equivalent to $50NL), during which I moved exclusively to 6max, before moving up to £50NL. Ran hot there for 25k hands, and at about 12.5k (this is including bonuses and rakeback - though I never did the bonus whoring thing) moved up to $100NL, which may be financially the same as £50 but is a whole new game.

I have so far played about 15k hands at my new level, and am making 4ptbb/100 or so, as well as about $500 in rb/bonus per 10k hands. BR is probably about $8k, having withdrawn about $5.5k for flights and computers.

I still play SNGs and MTTs occasionally, for fun/lack of stress, but no higher than $11 buyins.

As you can tell, I didn't move up when I was rolled for new stakes - I stuck stubbornly within my comfort zone until I felt comfortable enough to move up. At $100, I'd hardly say I'm comfortable, but I am beginning to believe that I can grind out a small positive rate here.

I started with $50 on Pokerstars in Feb 2006, played $25nl and progressed my way up to $100nl and have built my bankroll up to $8k. Yeah, not the model of bankroll managment (at least intially), but realize that for every story like this one, there is 1000 that you never hear which can be summed up like this: I keep LOSING money! It ain't easy. It takes a lot of discipline. But like most things, some people are naturals at it (not me) and others will have to work harder to be sucessful. Don't compare yourself to some of the best players out there--just practice patience, discipline and playing a solid strategy. Play the 19 hand strategy (that's where I started), get some winning under your belt and then expand your game from there.

Renton's guide is good: http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...oker-36037.htm

If you can read and apply the above, and play thousands of hands a month without spewing, you should find yourself moving up fairly quickly.

Originally Posted by Pelion

Originally Posted by Chopper

played the $5 NL and $10 NL all off of a "borrowed" $25,

Originally Posted by Chopper

...and GOOD BR MGMT

lol doesnt sound like it ;p

oh darn. looks like i've been caught with my pants down.

but i dont know many that buy in for $100 and play the 5 NL's because of BR MGMT, either. you gotta take your shots in the beginning, but once you learn about br mgmt, put it into practice like religion.

funny one, pel

Sounds very similar to me. I have decided to "start all over" again with a much different focus. Re-read my poker books & found Mr. Caro's line that is my new goal. Best I can remember it.

"You do not get paid for winning pots, you get paid for making good decisions"

I am now focused on learning to make "good decisions" in the right place, at the right time, in all areas of the game. From BR management to the tables. Poker is more than just playing the cards. Much more. I have much to learn but I now feel more confident that I am at least heading down the right road.

Good hunting.

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